How To Make Your Hospitality Business More Sustainable

Transcript

Speaker: 00:00:00

Welcome to Talking Hospitality.

00:00:02,158 --> 00:00:03,838

I'm Tracy Rashid.

00:00:03,838 --> 00:00:08,958

And I'm Sarah Kettel Today's episode is a

hot topic, sustainability.

00:00:09,318 --> 00:00:13,298

Sustainability is a critical concept that

focuses on meeting the needs of the

00:00:13,298 --> 00:00:17,658

present without compromising the ability

of the future generations to meet their

00:00:17,658 --> 00:00:18,818

own needs.

00:00:18,978 --> 00:00:23,848

It encompasses environmental, social and

economic dimensions, aiming to create a

00:00:23,848 --> 00:00:27,868

balanced and harmonious relationship

between society, the environment and the

00:00:27,868 --> 00:00:28,526

economy.

00:00:28,526 --> 00:00:31,302

And our guest today is right in the thick

of it.

00:00:39,310 --> 00:00:41,506

Thanks for watching!

00:00:45,614 --> 00:00:51,154

Since 2015, our guest Andrea Zick has been

working as a PA to the GM at the Oxo Tower

00:00:51,154 --> 00:00:52,894

Restaurant Bar and Brasserie.

00:00:52,894 --> 00:00:56,344

In this role, she's led the business to

win the accolade of Food Made Good

00:00:56,344 --> 00:01:01,474

Community Champion from the Sustainable

Restaurant Association in 2017.

00:01:01,474 --> 00:01:05,214

She then went on to lead the Oxo Tower

Restaurant Bar and Brasserie to win the

00:01:05,214 --> 00:01:09,384

Most Sustainable Restaurant at the

National Restaurants Awards 2019 and a

00:01:09,384 --> 00:01:11,474

Green Michelin Star in 2021.

00:01:11,474 --> 00:01:12,366

Welcome, Andrea.

00:01:12,366 --> 00:01:15,046

We are so pleased to have you here as our

guest today.

00:01:15,046 --> 00:01:15,646

How are you?

00:01:15,646 --> 00:01:20,386

I'm very well and it's wonderful to meet

you in person, I'd like to say, even

00:01:20,386 --> 00:01:21,366

though it's virtual.

00:01:21,366 --> 00:01:23,226

So we can hear there's a lot of background

noise.

00:01:23,226 --> 00:01:24,706

Where are you at the moment?

00:01:24,746 --> 00:01:26,326

I'm actually at the restaurant.

00:01:26,326 --> 00:01:31,666

I've taken basically an hour out of work

to meet you and to talk a little bit about

00:01:31,666 --> 00:01:34,646

very much my personal views on

sustainability.

00:01:34,646 --> 00:01:38,336

So not really representing the business

here in the conversation, but sharing

00:01:38,336 --> 00:01:40,270

hopefully some insights of.

00:01:40,270 --> 00:01:43,690

my journey in sustainability with others.

00:01:43,690 --> 00:01:47,120

So now some of you might be thinking we've

all heard about sustainability, we know

00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:51,330

what it is, we know it's a good thing, but

what does sustainability actually mean?

00:01:51,330 --> 00:01:57,010

You obviously did a very good job in

explaining it, at least defining it in the

00:01:57,010 --> 00:02:00,130

intro, which would have probably been how

I would have started.

00:02:00,130 --> 00:02:05,570

And maybe I go one step further and say

what sustainability means for me in a

00:02:05,570 --> 00:02:07,010

business context.

00:02:07,010 --> 00:02:10,094

I would say what it really means is to

00:02:10,094 --> 00:02:16,084

go into dialogue with every person in the

business about if you like the practices

00:02:16,084 --> 00:02:20,534

they are currently applying and

understanding how these practices may

00:02:20,534 --> 00:02:23,494

influence these three dimensions you

mentioned.

00:02:23,514 --> 00:02:28,224

The environment, social and governance, or

the people, the planet and the profit of

00:02:28,224 --> 00:02:28,894

the business.

00:02:28,894 --> 00:02:35,024

And then literally exploring how their

practices, if they're influencing these

00:02:35,024 --> 00:02:38,318

things, could be improved, changed.

00:02:38,318 --> 00:02:40,378

and transitioned to something different.

00:02:40,378 --> 00:02:44,518

Yeah, that's definitely a bit more

elaborated than what we said as a

00:02:44,518 --> 00:02:47,458

definition of sustainability without a

doubt.

00:02:47,458 --> 00:02:50,518

I think communication is a core

ingredient.

00:02:50,518 --> 00:02:54,298

So as a previous chef, I always think of

things and recipes.

00:02:54,298 --> 00:02:57,138

Communication is one of the important

ingredients.

00:02:57,358 --> 00:03:02,948

I think it's also trying to be empathetic

for the needs of everyone who's actually

00:03:02,948 --> 00:03:08,206

creating the change processes, because

sustainability ultimately is a

00:03:08,206 --> 00:03:13,496

journey within that journey you are often

asking people to change the way they are

00:03:13,496 --> 00:03:19,526

currently working or to apply change to

the business they are in, the system they

00:03:19,526 --> 00:03:20,146

are in.

00:03:20,146 --> 00:03:25,596

And that often requires, and that's really

another key ingredient, empathy and

00:03:25,596 --> 00:03:28,926

compassion for when things aren't that

straightforward.

00:03:28,926 --> 00:03:33,716

And going back to the communication, it

isn't telling, it's literally a dialogue

00:03:33,716 --> 00:03:37,390

which is very different to you need to do

this.

00:03:37,390 --> 00:03:44,660

And I would say sustainability projects

become more successful if consensus and

00:03:44,660 --> 00:03:47,310

dialogue is the kind of starting point.

00:03:47,310 --> 00:03:51,160

And then people are also going into a

place where they are willing to

00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:52,170

experiment.

00:03:52,170 --> 00:03:57,670

And I always think I'm so lucky as a chef

back in my previous life.

00:03:57,670 --> 00:04:00,570

I always loved experimenting and being

creative.

00:04:00,570 --> 00:04:03,990

So sustainability probably uses some of

that.

00:04:03,990 --> 00:04:09,070

love for creation and being a little bit

of a maverick and trying things out.

00:04:12,730 --> 00:04:16,190

Andrea, I love the fact that you're saying

that, you know, it's not just about what

00:04:16,190 --> 00:04:20,120

you're doing wrong, but it's that journey,

it's understanding it's changed.

00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:23,610

When there's people involved, that's never

the easiest thing to do.

00:04:23,610 --> 00:04:28,110

It's so clear that you're passionate about

sustainability and what you do.

00:04:28,110 --> 00:04:29,870

But what inspired you?

00:04:29,870 --> 00:04:33,490

to get into that field, was it like a big

bang or was it like a slow process?

00:04:33,490 --> 00:04:34,610

How did you get into it?

00:04:34,610 --> 00:04:37,090

I wouldn't say it was a big bang.

00:04:37,090 --> 00:04:41,210

There's something I learned yesterday

called ancestral knowing.

00:04:41,210 --> 00:04:46,280

And ancestral knowing is kind of almost

the inherited knowledge we carry through

00:04:46,280 --> 00:04:47,730

our lives.

00:04:47,730 --> 00:04:54,920

So as a child in my family, I was lucky

enough to be exposed to a garden and the

00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:58,530

opportunity to grow things and to see how

things grow.

00:04:58,530 --> 00:04:59,278

And that...

00:04:59,278 --> 00:05:05,428

kind of almost planted the seed of

understanding the connection of how we

00:05:05,428 --> 00:05:08,448

influence the planet, it influences us

back.

00:05:08,448 --> 00:05:11,498

So that's something which happened a long,

long time ago.

00:05:11,518 --> 00:05:13,998

And then I studied nutrition and health.

00:05:13,998 --> 00:05:19,278

At that point, I got really interested in

the question of world hunger, food

00:05:19,278 --> 00:05:20,178

insecurity.

00:05:20,178 --> 00:05:25,288

Then I got increasingly more conscious of,

feel like the limitations, the

00:05:25,288 --> 00:05:27,736

environmental limitations of our planet.

00:05:27,736 --> 00:05:31,886

When you then go down that rabbit hole and

you realize all there is environmental

00:05:31,886 --> 00:05:36,366

limitations, you then also have to start

asking yourself what are the economic

00:05:36,366 --> 00:05:41,386

limitations for a business if there's only

so much the planet can give.

00:05:41,386 --> 00:05:44,826

And then there's maybe one other dimension

which got me there.

00:05:44,826 --> 00:05:46,510

I'm a yogi and...

00:05:46,510 --> 00:05:52,970

When you do yoga, you often connect

through the world in a lens where you fear

00:05:52,970 --> 00:05:54,570

that everything is connected.

00:05:54,570 --> 00:05:58,770

And I think that feeds into this idea of

sustainability as well.

00:05:58,770 --> 00:06:03,230

Andrea, I know you just mentioned about

being fortunate enough to grow up with,

100

00:06:03,230 --> 00:06:05,270

you know, seeing food grown in a garden.

101

00:06:05,270 --> 00:06:07,330

And I was very much like that as well.

102

00:06:07,330 --> 00:06:12,238

It's always been important to me to pass

it on to my children and understand about.

103

00:06:12,238 --> 00:06:16,118

food wastage and the process and all those

kind of things that we should be very,

104

00:06:16,118 --> 00:06:17,058

very conscious of.

105

00:06:17,058 --> 00:06:22,898

And we've heard very much about these

strategies such as farm to fork.

106

00:06:23,138 --> 00:06:27,728

So how do you work with Oxo to develop

menus that really emphasize

107

00:06:27,728 --> 00:06:28,778

sustainability?

108

00:06:28,878 --> 00:06:33,808

Whatever sustainability practices and

projects you want to implant, it's always

109

00:06:33,808 --> 00:06:38,358

important to almost assess the present

first.

110

00:06:38,358 --> 00:06:41,550

So talking to the team you are working in.

111

00:06:41,550 --> 00:06:46,720

assessing what are we doing currently,

then ask yourself what's the future vision

112

00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:51,320

and even with that future vision you want

to bring in the people who are working

113

00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:55,630

with you because my vision might be very

different to your vision, right?

114

00:06:55,630 --> 00:07:01,480

And unless we are kind of trying to create

a joint vision it will be really hard to

115

00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:03,450

actually transition from A to B.

116

00:07:03,450 --> 00:07:04,878

And when you've created...

117

00:07:04,878 --> 00:07:09,378

basically the present and the future, you

can then think about what transition plans

118

00:07:09,378 --> 00:07:10,998

you can take.

119

00:07:10,998 --> 00:07:15,718

And these transition plans will be very

different for different businesses.

120

00:07:15,958 --> 00:07:20,918

So within the business we are working in,

it kind of feels like a dance.

121

00:07:20,918 --> 00:07:27,218

We introduce something, we test it, we use

what feels right for our business, and

122

00:07:27,218 --> 00:07:30,218

then remove the things which don't quite

feel right.

123

00:07:36,814 --> 00:07:41,574

As an example, we've worked on food waste

reduction for quite a while.

124

00:07:41,574 --> 00:07:45,304

We started this when the Sustainable

Restaurant Association launched something

125

00:07:45,304 --> 00:07:50,114

called Food Waste Bad Pest and that was

linked to the organization called Rapids,

126

00:07:50,114 --> 00:07:55,814

an NGO, and they tackle waste on a broader

scale, but food waste is one of the

127

00:07:55,814 --> 00:07:56,634

things.

128

00:07:57,838 --> 00:08:02,648

Really it started simple with us saying,

okay, we want to get an understanding of

129

00:08:02,648 --> 00:08:04,538

how much food waste we are creating.

130

00:08:04,638 --> 00:08:10,888

And then we started measuring and while we

started measuring, we learned about how

131

00:08:10,888 --> 00:08:16,238

are we actually creating waste, in what

areas are we creating waste, who might be

132

00:08:16,238 --> 00:08:21,458

the best person to tell us what waste is

created, then who are the people who might

133

00:08:21,458 --> 00:08:24,518

have the biggest influence in reducing

this waste.

134

00:08:24,518 --> 00:08:26,414

We started it this way and then...

135

00:08:26,414 --> 00:08:31,104

we went on to a journey of learning that

was supported by then eventually signing

136

00:08:31,104 --> 00:08:33,154

up to the Guardians of Grubb training.

137

00:08:33,154 --> 00:08:37,014

A whole bunch of people in the business

trained on the Guardians of Grubb training

138

00:08:37,014 --> 00:08:40,884

that allowed us then to kind of connect

front of house and back of house on this

139

00:08:40,884 --> 00:08:42,934

kind of mission to produce food based.

140

00:08:42,934 --> 00:08:47,914

I've done the the wrap Guardians of the

Grubb training as well and it's really

141

00:08:47,914 --> 00:08:52,124

inspirational and as a chef in the kitchen

you don't really think about what are the

142

00:08:52,124 --> 00:08:54,350

what are the front of house doing and how

how do they.

143

00:08:54,350 --> 00:08:57,470

Like you fill in a questionnaire at the

beginning and one of the first questions

144

00:08:57,470 --> 00:08:59,570

is, who are the people in your restaurant?

145

00:08:59,570 --> 00:09:01,150

Who are your key stakeholders?

146

00:09:01,150 --> 00:09:03,260

And it does actually go through front of

house.

147

00:09:03,260 --> 00:09:08,350

And that's sort of made me go, oh, oh

yeah, okay, it does have an impact.

148

00:09:08,350 --> 00:09:09,970

And I really hadn't thought about it

before.

149

00:09:09,970 --> 00:09:14,000

So for anyone who's not done Guardians of

the Grub training, I would suggest doing

150

00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:15,390

it for all your staff.

151

00:09:15,390 --> 00:09:17,510

It's really good, really insightful.

152

00:09:21,902 --> 00:09:27,612

I'm very pleased to say that our ambition

to reduce food waste by half since we

153

00:09:27,612 --> 00:09:30,282

started the measuring is on track.

154

00:09:30,282 --> 00:09:35,072

We still kind of see spikes and troughs,

so it's something we certainly want to

155

00:09:35,072 --> 00:09:36,502

continue looking at.

156

00:09:36,502 --> 00:09:40,662

But we are certainly on track achieving

that, and that's just such an amazing

157

00:09:40,662 --> 00:09:41,112

achievement.

158

00:09:41,112 --> 00:09:45,212

And this wouldn't be possible if we

wouldn't have brought in different team

159

00:09:45,212 --> 00:09:50,462

members, even if you think there's

sometimes invisible places.

160

00:09:50,462 --> 00:09:50,830

So...

161

00:09:50,830 --> 00:09:55,540

our sales team and our reservations teams

are just as important in this process

162

00:09:55,540 --> 00:10:02,430

because if for whatever reason they are

missing to update the bookings, then we

163

00:10:02,430 --> 00:10:04,210

potentially overproduce.

164

00:10:04,210 --> 00:10:10,210

If they are not putting in the information

of someone being an allergen in events,

165

00:10:10,210 --> 00:10:13,690

again, we probably produce food, but it's

not edible by these guests.

166

00:10:13,690 --> 00:10:17,998

So it becomes like a network operation and

you really want to bring in.

167

00:10:17,998 --> 00:10:22,388

as many people as possible, but equally

you need to streamline it so you can

168

00:10:22,388 --> 00:10:23,918

actually start progressing.

169

00:10:23,918 --> 00:10:26,418

I have a question for you both actually

being chefs.

170

00:10:26,418 --> 00:10:31,268

There's a very much like background of,

you know, making sure that something is as

171

00:10:31,268 --> 00:10:34,108

square as possible, even if it was

originally round.

172

00:10:34,108 --> 00:10:37,918

So there's wastage and things that, you

presentation is obviously very important,

173

00:10:37,918 --> 00:10:40,578

especially the more high end you go with,

with the cuisine.

174

00:10:40,578 --> 00:10:45,108

So is it more difficult to bring those

types of chefs, especially maybe the old

175

00:10:45,108 --> 00:10:47,790

school, along the sustainability journey?

176

00:10:47,790 --> 00:10:53,090

In weird ways, that's maybe something I'm

exploring in my PhD research to a level.

177

00:10:53,090 --> 00:11:00,370

It's not the main focus, but it's somewhat

generational difference between how we see

178

00:11:00,370 --> 00:11:02,350

good food to sum it up.

179

00:11:02,350 --> 00:11:08,630

So I think if you speak to someone who's

going to culinary schools now with the

180

00:11:08,630 --> 00:11:13,990

vice and sustainability conversation and

messaging, I think there's probably more

181

00:11:13,990 --> 00:11:16,494

of an awareness that good food.

182

00:11:16,494 --> 00:11:18,294

has to be linked to that as well.

183

00:11:18,294 --> 00:11:25,264

Whereas traditionally, I would say, chefs

probably associated good food with taste

184

00:11:25,264 --> 00:11:27,714

and indulgence and hedonism.

185

00:11:27,714 --> 00:11:30,284

And I'm not saying that this isn't true

still.

186

00:11:30,284 --> 00:11:35,054

I think we are almost adding another

dimension now into how we want to create

187

00:11:35,054 --> 00:11:38,114

food and kind of taking that on board.

188

00:11:38,114 --> 00:11:39,414

What do you think, Sarah?

189

00:11:39,414 --> 00:11:43,954

I think previously where you'd have seen

perhaps, you know, the good example is the

190

00:11:43,954 --> 00:11:45,742

case of fish, right, where

191

00:11:45,742 --> 00:11:49,012

previously, you might have seen a piece

cut off the side or a piece cut off the

192

00:11:49,012 --> 00:11:50,702

end to square the shape.

193

00:11:50,702 --> 00:11:52,642

And that would have been considered waste.

194

00:11:52,642 --> 00:11:54,342

But you really wouldn't see that now.

195

00:11:54,342 --> 00:11:58,032

And you know, even things like fish skin,

it's, it's become cool to eat fish skin

196

00:11:58,032 --> 00:11:58,822

crackling.

197

00:11:58,822 --> 00:12:00,502

Yeah, like skin would have been discarded

before.

198

00:12:00,502 --> 00:12:07,552

Can you still make beautiful food, which

is a direct to your eyes, not over

199

00:12:07,552 --> 00:12:08,022

trimming?

200

00:12:08,022 --> 00:12:09,062

Yeah, of course you can.

201

00:12:09,062 --> 00:12:11,096

And I think people have moved towards

202

00:12:17,582 --> 00:12:21,842

So, Andrea, how can the hospitality

industry have a bigger voice in food

203

00:12:21,842 --> 00:12:23,342

systems for sustainable eating?

204

00:12:23,342 --> 00:12:24,362

It's a big question.

205

00:12:24,362 --> 00:12:28,932

And the reason why it's a big question is

that it's because hospitality is so

206

00:12:28,932 --> 00:12:29,722

varied.

207

00:12:29,722 --> 00:12:31,782

So I give you an example.

208

00:12:31,782 --> 00:12:37,964

If you're a hotel or an events company,

the impact of your...

209

00:12:37,964 --> 00:12:41,514

business will sit in a different area than

a restaurant.

210

00:12:41,514 --> 00:12:45,154

If we are just looking at greenhouse gas

emissions and that of course isn't the

211

00:12:45,154 --> 00:12:50,364

only dimensions we might be considering

within sustainability, a hotel's

212

00:12:50,364 --> 00:12:54,114

greenhouse gas emissions are likely to be

much higher in the transport of their

213

00:12:54,114 --> 00:12:58,874

guests coming to the hotel proportionately

than maybe the food specifically.

214

00:12:58,874 --> 00:13:02,874

Let's say if you're a hotel which just

does bed and breakfast, right?

215

00:13:02,874 --> 00:13:06,598

You're already just by buying produce,

you're

216

00:13:06,670 --> 00:13:09,080

costs are already lower on the food side.

217

00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:14,280

So how a hotel will influence the

conversation around environmental

218

00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:17,850

conversations will be slightly different

to maybe a restaurant.

219

00:13:17,850 --> 00:13:21,900

Then again, with events, similar thing

with events, you're probably going to have

220

00:13:21,900 --> 00:13:23,650

guests traveling in.

221

00:13:23,650 --> 00:13:28,840

And that might also have a much, much

higher impact on the overall footprint the

222

00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:29,970

business is generating.

223

00:13:29,970 --> 00:13:35,470

For me, and that's kind of where I like to

say I'm a bit more specialized maybe.

224

00:13:35,470 --> 00:13:41,590

I look at how food in particular, food and

drink impact the planet.

225

00:13:41,590 --> 00:13:46,680

And that's because I work in a restaurant

and a lot of the certainly greenhouse gas

226

00:13:46,680 --> 00:13:50,830

emissions and probably a lot of the other

environmental impacts are driven by the

227

00:13:50,830 --> 00:13:52,000

food and drink we are buying.

228

00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,170

I don't want to ignore that when we are

switching on the light, when we are

229

00:13:55,170 --> 00:13:59,210

switching on the hops, that's what you

call in sustainability language, scope one

230

00:13:59,210 --> 00:14:02,010

and two emissions, they play a role as

well.

231

00:14:02,010 --> 00:14:04,238

But if you start looking at...

232

00:14:04,238 --> 00:14:06,638

where are the biggest impact of our

business?

233

00:14:06,638 --> 00:14:11,458

They tend to sit in the things we are

buying and then selling, prospectively.

234

00:14:11,458 --> 00:14:17,028

That means that understanding when we are

buying food, where it's coming from, how

235

00:14:17,028 --> 00:14:20,878

it's being produced, is becoming

increasingly more important.

236

00:14:20,878 --> 00:14:25,838

And then the next layer, and that's

certainly my view, when you're starting to

237

00:14:25,838 --> 00:14:29,458

think about, okay, it's food and drink,

which has potentially the biggest impact

238

00:14:29,458 --> 00:14:33,514

in the business, on the planet, then how

can we now

239

00:14:33,514 --> 00:14:40,394

modulate the food and drink offer to

remove some of these impacts or reduce

240

00:14:40,394 --> 00:14:46,704

some of these impacts and still deliver

the sort of experience our guests are

241

00:14:46,704 --> 00:14:47,634

looking after.

242

00:14:47,634 --> 00:14:49,774

They still want to eat luxuriously.

243

00:14:49,774 --> 00:14:52,574

They still want to treat themselves coming

to the restaurant.

244

00:14:52,574 --> 00:14:57,494

As a more practical example, if you come

to the restaurant at the moment, we sell

245

00:14:57,494 --> 00:14:58,158

beef.

246

00:14:58,158 --> 00:15:02,378

people love to treat themselves coming to

a restaurant and say, this is my one time

247

00:15:02,378 --> 00:15:04,558

a year where I might actually treat

myself.

248

00:15:04,558 --> 00:15:07,518

So they're probably going to order a beef

fillet.

249

00:15:07,518 --> 00:15:09,358

It's one of our best sellers.

250

00:15:09,358 --> 00:15:13,398

Now from sustainability point of view,

that's drama for me, because it's got one

251

00:15:13,398 --> 00:15:15,218

of the highest impacts.

252

00:15:15,218 --> 00:15:21,098

So removing it from the menu is probably

not an option at this moment in time.

253

00:15:21,098 --> 00:15:24,938

Yeah, but what we can do is asking

ourselves, how can we actually get the

254

00:15:24,938 --> 00:15:26,222

beef on the plate?

255

00:15:26,222 --> 00:15:28,182

in the lowest impact version.

256

00:15:28,182 --> 00:15:34,482

So asking ourselves, can we find a farmer

who farms the cutter in ways which are

257

00:15:34,482 --> 00:15:35,722

more regenerative?

258

00:15:35,722 --> 00:15:39,582

Can we consider maybe the size of the cut?

259

00:15:39,582 --> 00:15:45,262

Is the way we are putting that leaf onto

the plate producing waste which is

260

00:15:45,262 --> 00:15:45,982

unnecessary?

261

00:15:45,982 --> 00:15:48,752

And can we reduce that waste around it,

for example?

262

00:15:48,752 --> 00:15:53,642

So it's kind of asking ourselves, what are

the things we can influence by still

263

00:15:53,642 --> 00:15:55,942

delivering what our guests are looking

for?

264

00:16:03,214 --> 00:16:04,304

It's so insightful.

265

00:16:04,304 --> 00:16:08,384

There's so much going on in the background

that as a consumer, you don't really

266

00:16:08,384 --> 00:16:12,374

realize it's just a piece of meat, you

know, but there's so much that goes on

267

00:16:12,374 --> 00:16:12,564

behind.

268

00:16:12,564 --> 00:16:17,224

And you saying that there's like tears of

the kind of emissions has never even

269

00:16:17,224 --> 00:16:18,614

crossed my mind before.

270

00:16:18,614 --> 00:16:23,424

And the fact that restaurants or hotels

take ownership of their customers journey

271

00:16:23,424 --> 00:16:25,194

footprint as well.

272

00:16:25,194 --> 00:16:27,014

That's definitely news to me.

273

00:16:27,014 --> 00:16:28,914

It's quite a responsibility.

274

00:16:28,994 --> 00:16:29,764

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

275

00:16:29,764 --> 00:16:30,763

I never.

276

00:16:30,763 --> 00:16:34,083

To me, I wouldn't have thought that was

part of their responsibility, you know?

277

00:16:34,083 --> 00:16:38,443

I would say there's still a little bit of

a debate around what proportion they

278

00:16:38,443 --> 00:16:42,473

should be taking ownership of, because

there's a difference and this is when it

279

00:16:42,473 --> 00:16:43,373

gets very technical.

280

00:16:43,373 --> 00:16:47,943

So when you do life cycle analysis, which

is where you're trying to assess how much

281

00:16:47,943 --> 00:16:52,393

greenhouse gas emissions or how much

impacts are going into a product, a

282

00:16:52,393 --> 00:16:55,323

service, you make assumptions.

283

00:16:55,343 --> 00:17:00,231

And is it right to assume that someone

traveling to the restaurant is only

284

00:17:00,331 --> 00:17:05,291

coming to the restaurant for only meeting

the restaurant, only eating there, or

285

00:17:05,291 --> 00:17:08,711

where they're on a journey already

somewhere and passing through.

286

00:17:08,971 --> 00:17:09,371

Right?

287

00:17:09,371 --> 00:17:13,501

So therefore, you then have to ask

yourself, do we need to challenge some of

288

00:17:13,501 --> 00:17:14,221

these assumptions?

289

00:17:14,221 --> 00:17:17,891

And that will vary again for each

business.

290

00:17:17,891 --> 00:17:19,771

Yeah, that's a tough one.

291

00:17:19,811 --> 00:17:24,721

A central London restaurant is probably

more likely in a position where someone is

292

00:17:24,721 --> 00:17:28,541

passing through, whereas if I am a

destination restaurant in a beautiful

293

00:17:28,541 --> 00:17:29,355

space,

294

00:17:29,355 --> 00:17:33,645

In the countryside, it's less likely that

someone is passing through there, actually

295

00:17:33,645 --> 00:17:38,115

making the journey specifically for that

restaurant.

296

00:17:38,115 --> 00:17:38,325

Yeah.

297

00:17:38,325 --> 00:17:40,595

Sarah asked you a question about the food

systems.

298

00:17:40,595 --> 00:17:45,315

So can you tell us more about the UK Food

Systems Centre for doctoral training and

299

00:17:45,315 --> 00:17:48,995

how you think the next generation of

doctors will approach diet advice?

300

00:17:49,195 --> 00:17:53,235

So the UK Food Systems Centre for doctoral

training is where I'm currently doing my

301

00:17:53,235 --> 00:17:54,027

PhD.

302

00:17:54,027 --> 00:18:00,127

It's based in Greenwich and it's training

60 students in the UK food system.

303

00:18:00,127 --> 00:18:05,057

And when we talk about the UK food system,

people often don't really quite know what

304

00:18:05,057 --> 00:18:05,967

the food system is.

305

00:18:05,967 --> 00:18:11,087

So the food system, as I would define it

as a PhD student, is basically everything

306

00:18:11,087 --> 00:18:14,037

which is involved in getting food to our

table.

307

00:18:14,037 --> 00:18:18,947

So that's the growing of the food,

transporting of the food, the processing,

308

00:18:18,947 --> 00:18:22,279

the potentially storing of the food, the

further.

309

00:18:22,283 --> 00:18:26,943

processing in a kitchen or in a

restaurant, then the distributing it and

310

00:18:26,943 --> 00:18:29,483

then also the what happens after it.

311

00:18:29,483 --> 00:18:34,523

So if there's food waste or if there's

waste or leftovers on the plate, what

312

00:18:34,523 --> 00:18:35,723

happens to it afterwards?

313

00:18:35,723 --> 00:18:37,193

That's part of it as well.

314

00:18:37,193 --> 00:18:42,673

And the people I'm lucky enough to spend

time with, so the other doctoral students

315

00:18:42,673 --> 00:18:47,713

and the lecturers and their supervisors,

they are all really, really keen on

316

00:18:47,713 --> 00:18:50,635

understanding how can we shift this big...

317

00:18:50,635 --> 00:18:57,215

beast if you like, to have better outcomes

for society, for the environment.

318

00:18:57,215 --> 00:19:01,655

Students look at different things, so some

might be working purely on farming, some

319

00:19:01,655 --> 00:19:06,445

might be looking at the logistics

processes, some might be interested in

320

00:19:06,445 --> 00:19:12,995

things like nutritionally, what do we need

to start growing to make sure that in the

321

00:19:12,995 --> 00:19:18,013

next generation we actually have healthier

diets and again that's a...

322

00:19:18,013 --> 00:19:23,203

spongy term, what I define as healthy

might not be what other people define as

323

00:19:23,203 --> 00:19:23,453

healthy.

324

00:19:23,453 --> 00:19:28,353

What policies would we need to put in

place and what governance systems do we

325

00:19:28,353 --> 00:19:32,743

need to put in place to actually have

different outcomes than we currently have.

326

00:19:32,743 --> 00:19:36,323

That's really interesting that you talk a

lot about governance and having the

327

00:19:36,323 --> 00:19:37,603

specialised area.

328

00:19:37,603 --> 00:19:42,453

I think for most consumers when we think

about sustainability, we might have the

329

00:19:42,453 --> 00:19:46,563

best intentions and we might have what I

would say are bigger aspirations for

330

00:19:46,563 --> 00:19:47,531

sustainability.

331

00:19:47,531 --> 00:19:50,011

the UK than we feel that our leaders do.

332

00:19:50,011 --> 00:19:53,811

Do you feel there's a disparity there and

do you think that can ever be bridged?

333

00:19:53,811 --> 00:20:01,851

The disparity lies in part in the

different goals government sets within

334

00:20:01,851 --> 00:20:02,971

their agenda.

335

00:20:02,971 --> 00:20:05,631

And that's really me kind of thinking out

loud.

336

00:20:05,631 --> 00:20:09,731

The government needs to deliver on

economic outcomes, it needs to deliver on

337

00:20:09,731 --> 00:20:14,155

public health outcomes, it needs to

deliver on environmental outcomes.

338

00:20:14,155 --> 00:20:18,605

And what they're trying to do is they're

trying to deliver all that often in one or

339

00:20:18,605 --> 00:20:22,255

two policies, which makes it really

difficult.

340

00:20:25,863 --> 00:20:32,683

They also need to bring together what I

would call public consensus about what do

341

00:20:32,683 --> 00:20:37,243

we define, what do we think is a healthy

diet, what would we say is a sustainable

342

00:20:37,243 --> 00:20:37,943

diet.

343

00:20:37,943 --> 00:20:43,443

And if we would just talk about what good

food means to each one of us, we probably

344

00:20:43,443 --> 00:20:45,503

would have very different views of that.

345

00:20:45,503 --> 00:20:50,313

And that's why it's often really difficult

to bring consensus between these two

346

00:20:50,313 --> 00:20:53,675

things, because there's different opinions

and...

347

00:20:53,675 --> 00:20:58,095

different values associated to different

aspects of the food system.

348

00:20:58,095 --> 00:20:59,635

Yeah, that's amazing.

349

00:20:59,635 --> 00:21:00,455

I will fess up here.

350

00:21:00,455 --> 00:21:03,935

I did completely go off script there

because this is a subject that I'm very

351

00:21:03,935 --> 00:21:06,155

passionate about and could talk about all

day.

352

00:21:06,155 --> 00:21:08,055

So it's really interesting to hear your

thoughts on that.

353

00:21:08,055 --> 00:21:11,765

But if we have any of our listeners who

are at the start of their own personal

354

00:21:11,765 --> 00:21:15,055

sustainability journey, or even if they're

well into it, what's the one piece of

355

00:21:15,055 --> 00:21:18,495

advice do you give them to stick with it

and just to keep going for the good of the

356

00:21:18,495 --> 00:21:20,395

planet, for society, for the economy?

357

00:21:20,395 --> 00:21:21,995

What can they do as an individual?

358

00:21:21,995 --> 00:21:28,075

I think what keeps me going personally is

using creativity and being curious while

359

00:21:28,075 --> 00:21:33,795

also wanting to understand someone else's

position within that.

360

00:21:34,235 --> 00:21:40,495

So it's kind of being empathetic to the

people around you, trying to truly listen

361

00:21:40,495 --> 00:21:47,025

what their needs are and then start from

where their needs sit and where they are

362

00:21:47,025 --> 00:21:48,935

at and start building from there.

363

00:21:48,935 --> 00:21:51,403

Because if you are not...

364

00:21:51,403 --> 00:21:56,873

bringing in the people from the place they

are currently at, it's going to be really

365

00:21:56,873 --> 00:21:59,503

difficult for you to get their support.

366

00:21:59,503 --> 00:22:04,383

And sometimes maybe it isn't about getting

their support, maybe it's about you

367

00:22:04,383 --> 00:22:05,243

supporting them.

368

00:22:05,243 --> 00:22:07,423

Yeah, that's great advice.

369

00:22:07,723 --> 00:22:11,373

And it definitely sounds like, you know,

it's not a one size fits all, which might

370

00:22:11,373 --> 00:22:13,513

be why people think going on this journey

might be difficult.

371

00:22:13,513 --> 00:22:16,693

But actually, when it's more personalised,

you're more connected and probably more

372

00:22:16,693 --> 00:22:18,183

likely to stick to it as well.

373

00:22:18,183 --> 00:22:20,491

As a hospitality person, it's...

374

00:22:20,491 --> 00:22:25,831

It's a beautiful way to connect with

people on a very authentic level.

375

00:22:25,831 --> 00:22:29,871

I've met some of the most interesting

people through this journey and sometimes

376

00:22:29,871 --> 00:22:33,111

they've challenged me, but challenge isn't

a bad thing.

377

00:22:33,131 --> 00:22:37,861

Challenge helps you to grow, to

transition, to change your own perceptions

378

00:22:37,861 --> 00:22:39,211

of what's right and wrong.

379

00:22:39,211 --> 00:22:41,991

Yeah, I think if you're thinking about

sustainability, it's bigger than yourself,

380

00:22:41,991 --> 00:22:42,551

isn't it?

381

00:22:42,551 --> 00:22:44,691

So it's not just about me, me, me.

382

00:22:44,691 --> 00:22:47,671

You are thinking of the planet really and

everyone that's on it.

383

00:22:47,671 --> 00:22:49,867

And it's a beautiful place to...

384

00:22:49,867 --> 00:22:53,807

have a reason to connect because I won't

have all the answers.

385

00:22:53,807 --> 00:22:59,857

Whereas if I bring other people's

knowledge and wisdom in, then I might get

386

00:22:59,857 --> 00:23:03,107

the right answers or might find better

solutions.

387

00:23:04,327 --> 00:23:08,047

Yes, it's time for Put the Copper Down,

Quick Fire Round question time.

388

00:23:08,047 --> 00:23:11,227

The rules of the game, Andrea, is to

answer the questions with one word

389

00:23:11,227 --> 00:23:11,887

answers.

390

00:23:11,887 --> 00:23:16,177

Now we know that one word answers may be

tricky for those in hospitality, so let's

391

00:23:16,177 --> 00:23:17,643

see how you get on.

392

00:23:17,643 --> 00:23:21,983

We'll be judging your answer by speed,

succinctness and perhaps anything

393

00:23:21,983 --> 00:23:23,853

arbitrary we choose to add.

394

00:23:23,853 --> 00:23:27,513

At the end of the season, we will tally up

the scores from each of our guests and the

395

00:23:27,513 --> 00:23:28,863

winner will receive.

396

00:23:28,863 --> 00:23:29,783

Are you ready, Andrea?

397

00:23:29,783 --> 00:23:31,193

Are you ready for what the prize is?

398

00:23:31,193 --> 00:23:34,003

It's a £10 Amazon voucher.

399

00:23:34,223 --> 00:23:36,803

So if you are ready, Andrea, let's begin.

400

00:23:36,803 --> 00:23:37,803

Oh, yes, I'm ready.

401

00:23:37,803 --> 00:23:41,303

So Andrea, if you were a flavour of ice

cream, what would you be?

402

00:23:41,303 --> 00:23:42,443

Tutti frutti.

403

00:23:42,443 --> 00:23:47,163

So thinking of, as an example, Christmas

and Easter, if you could create a new

404

00:23:47,163 --> 00:23:49,003

holiday, what would it be called?

405

00:23:49,003 --> 00:23:50,403

World Peace Day.

406

00:23:50,403 --> 00:23:53,783

What's the most unusual job you can

imagine yourself doing for a day?

407

00:23:53,783 --> 00:23:57,023

The first thing I was thinking of was

fire, a fire woman.

408

00:23:57,023 --> 00:23:59,033

What is your go -to karaoke style?

409

00:23:59,033 --> 00:24:00,483

I hate karaoke.

410

00:24:01,043 --> 00:24:02,163

Boo!

411

00:24:03,243 --> 00:24:05,223

Do you run hot or cold?

412

00:24:05,223 --> 00:24:06,023

Hot.

413

00:24:06,023 --> 00:24:10,023

If you could have dinner with any

fictional character, who would it be?

414

00:24:10,083 --> 00:24:12,331

Fuhua from...

415

00:24:12,331 --> 00:24:13,951

the never -ending story.

416

00:24:13,951 --> 00:24:17,831

Andrea, what's the weirdest talent that

you have that not many people know about?

417

00:24:18,511 --> 00:24:22,911

I dress my clothes from inside out.

418

00:24:28,843 --> 00:24:36,063

So if you could go to any place, real or

fictional, where would you go?

419

00:24:36,063 --> 00:24:39,043

This sounds boring but I would stay at the

Tames.

420

00:24:39,043 --> 00:24:41,883

So crisps, fried or baked?

421

00:24:41,963 --> 00:24:43,723

Baked, as a nutritionist.

422

00:24:43,723 --> 00:24:48,183

If you could switch lives with any

celebrity for a day, who would it be?

423

00:24:48,183 --> 00:24:49,303

Greta Thunberg.

424

00:24:49,303 --> 00:24:52,843

If you had the power to solve one global

issue, what would it be?

425

00:24:52,843 --> 00:24:56,583

I'd start with world peace, I think all

the others would be easier to solve

426

00:24:56,583 --> 00:24:57,323

afterwards.

427

00:24:57,323 --> 00:25:02,713

If you could collaborate with any person,

living or dead, on a project, who would it

428

00:25:02,713 --> 00:25:03,503

be?

429

00:25:03,503 --> 00:25:06,803

I would love to collaborate with George

Orwell.

430

00:25:06,803 --> 00:25:07,943

I like it.

431

00:25:08,823 --> 00:25:10,443

Fact or fiction?

432

00:25:10,603 --> 00:25:11,073

Fiction.

433

00:25:11,073 --> 00:25:12,043

We need more dreaming.

434

00:25:12,043 --> 00:25:16,683

Imagine you wake up one day with the

ability to speak every language fluently.

435

00:25:16,683 --> 00:25:19,183

How would you use this newfound skill?

436

00:25:19,183 --> 00:25:24,587

To bring people together to overcome

tension and problems.

437

00:25:24,587 --> 00:25:29,087

If your life had a theme song, Andrea,

that played every time you entered a room,

438

00:25:29,087 --> 00:25:30,167

what would it be?

439

00:25:30,167 --> 00:25:33,367

The first one coming to mind is Staying

Alive.

440

00:25:33,367 --> 00:25:36,807

What is your go -to dance move when no one

is watching?

441

00:25:36,807 --> 00:25:37,767

The shimmy?

442

00:25:37,767 --> 00:25:40,007

Beastenders or Coronation Street?

443

00:25:40,007 --> 00:25:41,047

Holly Ox?

444

00:25:41,047 --> 00:25:42,237

That's a bit younger, isn't it?

445

00:25:42,237 --> 00:25:44,587

It's more our generation, to be fair.

446

00:25:45,447 --> 00:25:47,207

Okay, this is a riddle.

447

00:25:47,207 --> 00:25:49,507

I have keys but no locks.

448

00:25:49,507 --> 00:25:51,567

I have space but no room.

449

00:25:51,567 --> 00:25:53,931

You can enter but you can't go into the...

450

00:25:53,931 --> 00:25:54,631

What am I?

451

00:25:54,631 --> 00:25:55,471

A box.

452

00:25:55,471 --> 00:25:58,251

What has a heart that doesn't beat?

453

00:25:58,251 --> 00:25:59,351

A clock.

454

00:25:59,771 --> 00:26:03,131

So your time is up, Andrea, and you made

it through.

455

00:26:03,131 --> 00:26:06,771

So the answers for the final two questions

were the first one was keyboard.

456

00:26:06,771 --> 00:26:07,611

I got that.

457

00:26:07,611 --> 00:26:09,451

And the second one was artichoke.

458

00:26:09,451 --> 00:26:10,921

OK, yeah, that's a good one.

459

00:26:10,921 --> 00:26:11,471

I didn't get that.

460

00:26:11,471 --> 00:26:13,431

So how do you think you scored?

461

00:26:13,431 --> 00:26:14,371

Really poorly.

462

00:26:14,371 --> 00:26:16,451

I'm not competitive like that.

463

00:26:16,451 --> 00:26:17,561

I'm the worst person.

464

00:26:17,561 --> 00:26:19,311

I always want the team to win.

465

00:26:19,311 --> 00:26:21,011

Oh, well, we're competitive.

466

00:26:21,011 --> 00:26:23,451

So, Senghor, do you want to tally up those

points?

467

00:26:24,459 --> 00:26:26,159

I got 16.

468

00:26:26,159 --> 00:26:27,879

Well, you got 16.

469

00:26:27,879 --> 00:26:31,399

And, Andrea, you're going to have to stay

tuned to find out at the end of the season

470

00:26:31,399 --> 00:26:37,359

if you've won our top of the range prize,

which I'm sure you're just dying to have.

471

00:26:37,599 --> 00:26:38,249

Thank you, Andrea.

472

00:26:38,249 --> 00:26:40,039

It's been great having you as a guest.

473

00:26:40,039 --> 00:26:43,959

We know that our listeners will make use

of the experience device that you've

474

00:26:43,959 --> 00:26:44,679

given.

475

00:26:44,819 --> 00:26:47,139

Thank you also to our listeners for

joining us today.

476

00:26:47,139 --> 00:26:51,403

Stay tuned for more insightful

conversations here on Talking Hospitality.

477

00:26:51,403 --> 00:26:55,533

And we'd like to thank our brand partner,

Graphic Kitchen, you our listeners, our

478

00:26:55,533 --> 00:26:57,483

guests and all of those who have supported

us.

479

00:26:57,483 --> 00:27:01,963

Please check us out at talkinghospitality

.com for the latest gossip, episodes,

480

00:27:01,963 --> 00:27:03,503

blogs and courses.

481

00:27:03,503 --> 00:27:04,333

Wishing you well.

482

00:27:04,333 --> 00:27:07,127

Thank you all for listening and stay

awesome.

483

00:27:13,227 --> 00:27:15,593

Thanks for watching!

How To Make Your Hospitality Business More Sustainable

Andrea Zick

Related to this Episode

Sustainable Hospitality: Strategies to Reduce Waste and Conserve Resources

New to Talking Hospitality?